Meno and Gorgias are both fine dialogues. It was a relief to talk about direct philosophy, but when the time was ready to begin Antigone I was ready to delve back into poetry; but that is skipping ahead.
We first discussed Meno. Twice. Can we all be virtuous? What is knowledge?
We discussed those questions a lot. Ms. Ames was worried that we all could not be virtuous and naturally we wrestled with that awhile. Meno seems only to desire power and use virtue to attain power over other men; is this good? Can he be good if he desires only this? We came to the conclusion that Socrates eventually gave up on him and fed him the divine dispensation argument merely to keep him out of politics, but hinting that Meno discover what virtue was rather than asking if it can be taught.
Gorgias was tougher for it attacked something I always liked - or thought I liked - rhetoric. Rhetoric is the art of persuasion, right? At least that is what I thought. But apparently rhetoric (according to Socrates) is the method of persuading someone without their best interest necessarily in mind. He likened it in a ratio to Justice as Cookery was to Medicine; flattering the pleasures. I suppose it could be taken that way; I mean, we have all heard of good rhetoricians who flatter the people to follow their appetites. With this in mind, I can see why Socrates was wary of rhetoric. "Rhetoric must only be used for justice", he says emphatically.
Big question: do we perhaps need rhetoric in our politicians? We don't have the time or energy to dialogue with each other on the political level (though I think perhaps we should) and most people wouldn't understand it anyway. A politician has to be able to emotionally persuade his audience and wow that sounds horrible but it is true. We need, perhaps, someone to say, "I have a dream". Perhaps we need to someone to say "We hold these truths to be self-evident...". More beautiful moments of rhetoric have seldom been produced.
Even though I still love rhetoric (I find I use it in the Socratic method - persuading people through logical argument) I have become thoroughly disillusioned with politics. I see little greatness in our society; great men like Achilles or Odysseus would be out of place; democracy has neither the patience with nor time for great souled men.
I am thinking now about my seminar paper.
I met Mr. Pagano this morning to discuss my paper and came away very exited for the possibilities of rewriting it. I need to consolidate my paragraphs, clarify my main points, and trim narrative from the ten pages, emphasizing my analysis. I think it will be in pretty good shape for the 5th of November.
Next up, Plato's Republic
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